Why you can't believe what you read.

Posted by: Jim_

Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/26/09 09:20 PM

Or why I'm so cynical of any media.

This is about our fair city and CNN's spin on it. Great ohh ahh press but nowhere near all the facts.

Here's the local take putting the fear of losing vital law enforcement services in as a plug for the tax.

What ticks me off is that they are using FUD to try and push the vote on the tax. They're using $200 million in stimulus money, plus local money, around a half billion or more total, to build a freaking 10 mile long light rail line from downtown to north of the city line, only one leg of many that are planned eventually, half a billion dollars. This is supposed to stimulate the local economy in the long run somehow by brining people into a downtown that has always rolled the sidewalks up at 6:00 for as long as I can remember. The mass transit here isn't very complex, but it doesn't need to be. The downtown area is only a little over a mile long, all down one stretch of road, not much branching out except for a block or so each side. We have a bus line and taxis that are having trouble getting riders, why try another venue?

People trying to make us the metropolis we'll never be.
Posted by: newkojak

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 03:24 AM

Just think about the different audiences for CNN and WBNS. CNN has to make the story relevant for a nation-wide audience, so they have to mention the irony that 25 cops that President Obama made such a big deal out of might lose their jobs. Locally, the presidential angle is much less important. I don't stick up for CNN all that often, but they had to contextualize this story in a way that would make people from out of town care.

Light rail is a big we'll see. It works very well in some areas. In Chicago, if you were to build a new "L" line in an area of the city that didn't have one previously, you just raised the property value of the surrounding neighborhoods and gave all of the local businesses a breath of fresh customers. Light rail is the best stimulus we have in Chicago, but it works because there is a huge transportation hub downtown and being connected to the light rail system means also being connected to the commuter rail system, Amtrak, two international airports, and a ton of attractions downtown.

If Columbus has a commuting population to the north of the city, light rail isn't a terrible idea to attract people to the area. They should start with heavy commuter rail though first. It's easier to start up and can connect to any future light rail system if they're smart about how they collect fares.
Posted by: polymerase

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 04:04 AM

You might have better luck keeping the sidewalks unrolled to midnight if you would stop with the brining. Pickled people postpone purchases.
Posted by: mojo_jojo

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 04:37 AM

It's more of the same. Look what California just did. No, no, no and damn NO. Government services need to be trimmed by 40% and even that will still leave way too much waste. Non-stimulous money is only a veiled attempt to entrench government even further.
Posted by: garyW

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 07:41 AM

Originally Posted By: mojo_jojo
e of the same. Look what California just did. No, no, no and damn NO. Government services need to be trimmed by 40% and even that will still leave way too much waste. Non-stimulous money is only a veiled attempt to entrench government even further.


In the news today, stuff we can be really proud of ...

Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger on Tuesday sent lawmakers his plan to trim more than $5 billion in spending by dismantling or drastically curtailing state programs that provide Californians with healthcare, higher education, welfare, parks, AIDS treatment and counseling, prisoner rehabilitation and other services ... ... by eliminating the CalWorks welfare program and the Healthy Families program for children's healthcare -- which would affect 930,000 children-- the state could save nearly $1.6 billion. But it would also lose $4.7 billion in federal funds.






Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 09:11 AM

Originally Posted By: polymerase
You might have better luck keeping the sidewalks unrolled to midnight if you would stop with the brining. Pickled people postpone purchases.
The downtown is only geared towards, and has always been geared towards 9 to 5 offices so even if the pickles left the jar they would have no where to go. This is an entirely different city from the East coast big city models so you can't compare to what you live in. It's a small city that wants to be a Chicago. It's a farm town, not a culture haven. We have no multitudes of entertainment in the downtown. There isn't a variety of theaters, shows, etc. It's office space.

"Downtown" stretches a whopping 8 blocks long, and about 4 blocks wide with a highway on one side and a river on the other. Outside of the metro area are dwellings, so the commerce ends abruptly. A one mile stretch 4 block wide stretch. Look out your window and compare.

There is plenty of parking, especially after 5 when the workers go home and vacate the garages and parking lots. Getting there and parking is not a problem, it's having something to do once you get there. They tried City Center. Easy access, dirt cheap or free parking onsite. It's being leveled.

It's a supreme waste of half a billion dollars.
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 09:20 AM

Originally Posted By: newkojak
Light rail is the best stimulus we have in Chicago, but it works because there is a huge transportation hub downtown and being connected to the light rail system means also being connected to the commuter rail system, Amtrak, two international airports, and a ton of attractions downtown.
As I mentioned, our downtown is 8 blocks long by about 4 blocks wide, totally different. I know Chicago, been there many times. There is more entertainment going on in the two blocks around the Sears tower than the whole downtown area here. The one thing we do have going is parking, which in Chicago is minimum and premium so a good public transport is needed, especially with as far as the downtown is spread out. There is also the lake on one side which attracts activity.
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 09:34 AM

Originally Posted By: newkojak
Just think about the different audiences for CNN and WBNS. CNN has to make the story relevant for a nation-wide audience, so they have to mention the irony that 25 cops that President Obama made such a big deal out of might lose their jobs. Locally, the presidential angle is much less important. I don't stick up for CNN all that often, but they had to contextualize this story in a way that would make people from out of town care.
In other words making something relevant to a nation-wide audience is not giving the whole story? What happened to giving all the facts so we can make up our own minds.

I forgot to mention the millions spent on fancy lighted arches across the main drag that shorted out the first year they lit up, 2002. They were out for 5 years, finally got the problems solved and lit up in 2007.

Now we have a fancy street but no cops to patrol it. The money goes to the wrong things around here.
Posted by: MacBozo

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 10:03 AM

We, generally, get to vote on the funding of major projects through referendums.
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 10:49 AM

Originally Posted By: MacBozo
We, generally, get to vote on the funding of major projects through referendums.
It was voted down 2 or 3 times here, they're going to try again. crazy


Posted by: carp

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 12:49 PM

I saw something that I thought interesting not sure it would work in the US

Spain has this great bicycle program with bike racks at all the rail stations and like every other block . You buy a plastic card for like 30 bucks a year , you get off the train go to the bike racks swipe the card and grab a bike . Real slick program

Wish I could find a link .
Posted by: newkojak

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 01:04 PM

Originally Posted By: Reboot
In other words making something relevant to a nation-wide audience is not giving the whole story? What happened to giving all the facts so we can make up our own minds.

Well, yeah... that's why I don't watch CNN or read USA Today. They both kind of suck as far as depth is concerned.
Posted by: mojo_jojo

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 01:18 PM

I can only hope and pray for the day when I can proudly read about something like that happening here in New York.
Posted by: mojo_jojo

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 01:19 PM

The seat and handle bars would have to be boiled between each use for me to touch one.
Posted by: carp

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 05:43 PM

I think gloves would take care of the handle bars , maybe surgical head cover would work for the seat ? ?

In the US them bikes would all be stolen in a week laugh No really was a cool system they got going and people love it .
Posted by: carp

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 06:01 PM

Originally Posted By: newkojak
Originally Posted By: Reboot
In other words making something relevant to a nation-wide audience is not giving the whole story? What happened to giving all the facts so we can make up our own minds.

Well, yeah... that's why I don't watch CNN or read USA Today. They both kind of suck as far as depth is concerned.


I tend to agree , I watch CNN and HLN , better then Fox

IMO
CNN is more of a news show , seems to me they cherry pick topics and focus on that - the only in depth story you would see is when they have a panel of experts on and its a hot topic

HLN the sister channel of CNN are very similar , however they tend to focus on the reporting the news rather then having these half hour shows like CNN does . Still its just reporting not in depth and after about an hour HLN repeats itself
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 09:01 PM

Originally Posted By: carp
I saw something that I thought interesting not sure it would work in the US

Spain has this great bicycle program with bike racks at all the rail stations and like every other block . You buy a plastic card for like 30 bucks a year , you get off the train go to the bike racks swipe the card and grab a bike . Real slick program

Wish I could find a link .
Wish I was in Hawaii. LOL.

That would work for about four months out of the year here. We have seasons with noticeable changes in Columbus, and only 1 of 4 is conducive to open air transport, and not all the time for that one either.
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 09:05 PM

Originally Posted By: newkojak
Well, yeah... that's why I don't watch CNN or read USA Today. They both kind of suck as far as depth is concerned.
Depth sucking we agree on. I still do read them but with a cautious eye. Hell, I even read your posts, I might learn something. wink
Posted by: MacBozo

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/27/09 09:09 PM

It must be h3ll living in fear of one thing or another. I'm surprised that you are not agoraphobic.
Posted by: SgtBaxter

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/28/09 09:19 AM

Originally Posted By: Reboot
People trying to make us the metropolis we'll never be.


Well with 1,892 officers you do have exactly 1,890 more than the town I live in. Main street in our town is ~2 miles long. Oh well, google maps did see fit to send a streetview van through.

I think your town is a little bit bigger than you're letting on wink
Posted by: ChrisN

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 12:32 AM

Hmmm.. Andy & Barney? wink

Chris
Posted by: ChrisN

OT - 05/29/09 12:37 AM

One of my sisters and brother in law will be moving to your area. Job transfer for him. I think he's there now looking for a house and working already. The rest of the family will join soon.

Chris
Posted by: Celandine

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 06:39 AM


Stripping away the stimulus yadda yadda:

I learned the Cautious Eye thing pretty early on**
in fact the day after my boa constrictor bit me.

I was entirely at fault for startling the sleeping
snake by grabbing it in the cage without putting
the lights on.

My dad (erring to the side of caution) took me to
the ER where I proceeded to explain how it had
happened. I doctor cleaned up the hundred or so
puncture wounds, explaining to my dad that it was
much less dangerous than a dog bite, (or human
bite for that matter) the snakes mouth being by
nature much cleaner... and gave me a booster tetanus
shot "In case I stepped on a nail." and sent me home.

The next day in the local news paper was a big splash
titled "A BOA BITES!" and going on to rail against
pet shops that sell "exotic pets" "badabe badaba..."

LOL they even got all the stats wrong. wrong address,
misspelt my name and so forth... what BS!

** if I often come off as cynical, it's a learned
cynicism ...most of which I picked up in my youth.
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 09:11 AM

Originally Posted By: SgtBaxter

I think your town is a little bit bigger than you're letting on wink
Well the population is 750,000 in the city limits, with another 1,000,000 in the surrounding suburbs and towns, but what is considered the downtown area is only a mile long and a few blocks wide, the area that the first phase (the half a billion $) of the light rail is supposed to benefit. It's mainly a residential city, not a lot of manufacturing (clean air cool) mainly assembly and office type business, and most of that is in the suburban areas, not the city proper so much. It's nickname is Cowlumbus. Not really a cultural hub.
Posted by: SgtBaxter

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 11:13 AM

Sounds kind of like Baltimore, only larger (Baltimore's population is around 650K).

Downtown proper of Baltimore isn't a huge area either, but the light rail that extends into the northern and southern suburbs and to the airport is fantastic. Initially I thought much like you. What a waste, there isn't a need for a light rail - then I rode it and found how convenient it was, and discovered an extra $50 a month in my pocket I saved on parking costs for college and work. I'd ride to to school, then hop on and jaunt over to the harbor on the other side of town afterwards for social activities, just one daily ticket. I still ride it down to Ravens stadium.

In ten years your view might be quite different too.
Posted by: polymerase

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 11:25 AM

You are describing a town much bigger than Boston and we have plenty of commuter rail but not nearly enough.

You're that big and you don't have any trains? No wonder they roll the sidewalks up. No one can go anywhere. Chicken and egg thing going on.
Posted by: yoyo52

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 03:48 PM

I was just talking to someone the other day about why I had to buy a car when I got a job out in Wellesley while I was living in Arlington. There was a way to do it by rail, but it would have taken a heck of a long time and uncanny timing to do it. You bet Boston needs more rail!
Posted by: polymerase

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 04:07 PM

Spokes of a wheel. If everyone worked at North Station everyone could take the train. But if you don't you could spend the day going in then out to get to your destination.
Posted by: Jim_

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/29/09 09:01 PM

Originally Posted By: polymerase
You are describing a town much bigger than Boston and we have plenty of commuter rail but not nearly enough.

You're that big and you don't have any trains? No wonder they roll the sidewalks up. No one can go anywhere.
Two entirely different places. We're a city in the middle of farmland. This place is single family dwellings for the majority. The population is a little more here, but the area is about 2.5 times the size of Boston, so the population in Boston is much more dense, I'd guess many more condos, apartments and high density dwellings.

Most everything outside of the city and suburbs here is country for at least 20 miles or more as compared to a pretty dense populace adjacent to Boston I believe, except the water of course. You can only go so far and you hit farmland in all directions here, the city and suburbs are about a 15 mile or so wide circle, then you're taking a train to cows. If the trains didn't drop you at cows at the end of the ride it may be a feasible plan.
Posted by: steveg

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 04:29 AM

Yeah. Newton, Wellesly Hills, Cambridge, Braintree and Revere at least have subway/streetcar access. Everywhere else requires bus transfers or commuter rail. And there's almost no redundancy. In NYC, you generally have at least two subway lines and a bus line to get from anywhere to anywhere else. If there's a shutdown on the F, for instance, and you want to get from W23 St. to 3rd Ave. in Midtown, you just walk two blocks east and grab the 6.
Posted by: MikeSellers

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 11:09 AM

Originally Posted By: garyW
Originally Posted By: mojo_jojo
e of the same. Look what California just did. No, no, no and damn NO. Government services need to be trimmed by 40% and even that will still leave way too much waste. Non-stimulous money is only a veiled attempt to entrench government even further.


In the news today, stuff we can be really proud of ...

Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger on Tuesday sent lawmakers his plan to trim more than $5 billion in spending by dismantling or drastically curtailing state programs that provide Californians with healthcare, higher education, welfare, parks, AIDS treatment and counseling, prisoner rehabilitation and other services ... ... by eliminating the CalWorks welfare program and the Healthy Families program for children's healthcare -- which would affect 930,000 children-- the state could save nearly $1.6 billion. But it would also lose $4.7 billion in federal funds.


Good for Schwarzenegger. If the people voted down tax increases and also don't want deficit spending, this is what happens. If they don't like the cuts he's proposing, then they need to come back with their own cost-saving measures. Either that or STFU.
Posted by: trey

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 12:09 PM

Quote:
The seat and handle bars would have to be boiled between each use for me to touch one.


Really? What do you sit on when you go to movie theatres and the like?

"Excuse me waiter, but I'm just gonna' stand out here on the sidewalk. Oh, and I brought my own dishes."


laugh
Posted by: carp

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 12:57 PM

LOL
Posted by: soulotomy

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 06:20 PM

Yeah, that's the way I feel.

People vote for this stuff, so they need to man up and suck it up.

It's a stroke of genius, really.

The people who lose their homes to California's fires (firefighting is getting gutted) can be the homeless caretakers/squatters to the 80 percent of state parks/facilities/etc that getting nuked. It's also a good place for the 30K released prisoners to hang out (actually, that's a good thing, since a lot of those are in prison over bullsh!t drug laws).

Ed

Of course, I like the order and poetry of chaos smile - I doubt others would fancy it as well when Chaos settles in their land.

Ah yes, it's almost weird enough, but not quite.

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. - - - Hunter Thompson.

Mongo like lizardworld.
Posted by: garyW

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 08:20 PM

Originally Posted By: MikeSellers
Good for Schwarzenegger. If the people voted down tax increases and also don't want deficit spending, this is what happens. If they don't like the cuts he's proposing, then they need to come back with their own cost-saving measures. Either that or STFU.


Arnold had no choice. And I think you've misunderstood my point of view, because I started a thread California screws self ... by not sucking up to a 1-cent sales tax hike and an increase in car registration fees.

And I clearly stated that the GOP and rightwing radio (locally) and FoxNews (nationally) pushed this as a "tax revolt" vote when it was really a "save our sorry asses" vote from the outcome we're going to have dumped on us.

The reality is that since Prop 13 the state's population has increased, the services needed increased, and the taxes collected decreased. Sure, businesses are taxed around 35%, but less that 7% is ever collected because of all the loopholes. So when there's nothing but deficits and spending has already been cut to the bone, people need to pay more taxes one way or another ... or we get this disaster for the people of California that you and mojo may think is such a good thing.


All those socialist agendas like adequate public schools, police, and fire protection, ... and protection of our State Parks ... are just fond memories.







Posted by: soulotomy

Re: Why you can't believe what you read. - 05/30/09 09:05 PM

Hey, that's why I moved down there. Prop 13 and the good deal on world class universities, plus California is the most bureaucratic state in the nation (except that growth management is a pathetic joke, if even a concept, but now that I better understand Calfornia, I get it). Well, beautiful country, too, and the weather's nice.

If people want a lot of stuff but don't want to pay for it, fuk the bollocks. What's new?

I'm just a lizard - What do I know? Into any free system, a little rape and pillage rain must fall.

Ed