Push a G4 gigabit farther question.

Posted by: mrbit

Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 05:17 PM

Ok I have upgraded a G4 gigabit  model with 2 gigs of ram and the Gigadesign 1.4 with L3 cache and have the 9800 pro in there.

Now, that said, I still want faster graphics IF I CAN GET IT.

I am willing to change out the logic board but do not know if the higher speed logic boards posts mystic will fit although I am willing to fabricate a solution.

I also realize if I go to a ddr lobo than I will sell my ram and get ddr.

I am running OSX and it runs great, but again I am after more graphics performance as I do not thing the 9800 is being used to its full potential.

Thanks for any suggestions or help
Posted by: mrbit

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 05:29 PM

I should add that I have the dual 1.4 ghz L3 Gigadesign cpus
Posted by: TCPMeta

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 05:32 PM

Theres all kinds of cards you can toss in but some need to be flashed.

If you have to change out the motherboard your best bet is to get a hold of a MDD or a G5.

Some reason the "secret" site for editing video cards for macs has rejected my membership so I have no idea what is the fastest compatible card that will work. Just look at a card you would like to use and google for a mac compatible card or see if theres a flash hack for it.
Posted by: mrbit

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 05:48 PM

TCP thanks for the reply I think the bottle neck is with the slow AGP 2x on the board.  THe vid card is the ATI 9800 pro 256 MAC edition, that was a pricey card so I will stick with it.  I think the highest I can go per gigadesigns site on my dual 1.4 is a quicksilver 2002 board.
Would a QS 2002 board fit in the gigabit case?
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 06:42 PM

Originally Posted By: "mrbit "

TCP thanks for the reply I think the bottle neck is with the slow AGP 2x on the board.  THe vid card is the ATI 9800 pro 256 MAC edition, that was a pricey card so I will stick with it.  I think the highest I can go per gigadesigns site on my dual 1.4 is a quicksilver 2002 board.
Would a QS 2002 board fit in the gigabit case?


You are exactly right about the 2X AGP being your bottleneck.  Don't expect AGP 4X to be twice as fast though.  In my experiences its maybe 1.5X faster.  A 9800 may even be overkill for AGP 4X so buying a new video card will just be wasting money.

If you are comfortable doing a bit of case modification you could get a QS board in there.  The main boost you would get with a QS board is the 133MHz bus vs. the 100MHz on your Gigabit. 

Hope this info helps..  good luck in your quest for PowerPC speed.  I myself have a real thing for dual PowerPC systems.  You could almost say they give me wood.  HAHAHA
Posted by: maestro

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 09:23 PM

You havent said why you want faster graphics.  Games?  If so, you need a new machine.  For pro apps though, you should be just fine, unless you are using Motion, then you still need a new machine.  You wont get much faster unless you go with a MDD or G5 and for the bucks, I say go with mactel.  That said, you have a very fine machine.

The QS board will not fit without some mods and to be honest, it is on the whole, cheaper to buy the whole machine as they are going for around 200 bucks right now.
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/24/07 09:37 PM

Another thought..  if you're determined to get AGP 4x by adding a new board then you're better off going with a Digital Audio board.  It would fit in your case with less modification and still has the 133MHz bus. 

Although a DA doesn't take DDR memory it doesn't really matter on a QS or any G4 tower that took DDR ram.  Why?  Because the system bus isn't fast enough to allow the memory to run at 2X the speed.  DDR memory is a tad faster on G4's but not even close to enough to make it worth replacing all your memory.

Is the memory PC133 or PC100?
Posted by: mrbit

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 01:46 AM

Originally Posted By: "zenstate "

Another thought..  if you're determined to get AGP 4x by adding a new board then you're better off going with a Digital Audio board.  It would fit in your case with less modification and still has the 133MHz bus. 

Although a DA doesn't take DDR memory it doesn't really matter on a QS or any G4 tower that took DDR ram.  Why?  Because the system bus isn't fast enough to allow the memory to run at 2X the speed.  DDR memory is a tad faster on G4's but not even close to enough to make it worth replacing all your memory.

Is the memory PC133 or PC100?


thanks for the reply, i love to mess with hardware and take old machines and max them out, its fun.  the ram is pc100m, so the DA will fit better than a QS?
Posted by: mrbit

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 01:54 AM

Originally Posted By: "maestro "

You havent said why you want faster graphics.  Games?  If so, you need a new machine.  For pro apps though, you should be just fine, unless you are using Motion, then you still need a new machine.  You wont get much faster unless you go with a MDD or G5 and for the bucks, I say go with mactel.  That said, you have a very fine machine.

The QS board will not fit without some mods and to be honest, it is on the whole, cheaper to buy the whole machine as they are going for around 200 bucks right now.


Thanks for the reply, no not games... i have a PC game rig that i enjoyed putting together while saving up for a mac pro some day.  for now the pc runs a liquid cooled e6400 OCed to 3.4ghz and ram to just under 1k.  I love G4's and cannot help to want to max them out and experiment with them.  I wish I were more familiar with them, thus the questions.  I already put good money into it via the chip and video card.  I just noticed the cpu getting tapped much more than i expected and then i saw that the AGP was 2x and the bus 100.  So, maybe a slight push for the fun of modding.  The only issue is that the vid is AGP 2x and 4x compat and the new gigadesign chip only works with the AGP line.  So I am trying to get to the max within reasonable limits of the machine. 
So the MDD or what machine is gong for 200?
Right now I use the G4 for everyday use and mainly photoshop.
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 05:52 AM

You will never find an MDD for only 200 unless it doesn't run.  He was referring to the QS.
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 10:48 AM

Originally Posted By: "mrbit "

Originally Posted By: "zenstate "

Another thought..  if you're determined to get AGP 4x by adding a new board then you're better off going with a Digital Audio board.  It would fit in your case with less modification and still has the 133MHz bus. 

Although a DA doesn't take DDR memory it doesn't really matter on a QS or any G4 tower that took DDR ram.  Why?  Because the system bus isn't fast enough to allow the memory to run at 2X the speed.  DDR memory is a tad faster on G4's but not even close to enough to make it worth replacing all your memory.

Is the memory PC133 or PC100?


thanks for the reply, i love to mess with hardware and take old machines and max them out, its fun.  the ram is pc100m, so the DA will fit better than a QS?


You will have te replace your RAM anyway as a DA needs PC133
Posted by: mrbit

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 03:36 PM

so what would i have to work up to get the da mobo in?
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 06:12 PM

Originally Posted By: "mrbit "

so what would i have to work up to get the da mobo in?


Some guts and a bit of creativity  smile
Posted by: maestro

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 07:41 PM

I would start by taking a look at the motherboards and where their posts are.  Also look at the backs of both cases for differences in backplates and pci slots.  You should be able to google those up no problem.
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/28/07 07:56 PM

The main objective is just to get it fastened down in a way that won't hurt it while also lining up the pci slots like maestro said.  Once you accomplish that its all gravy.  All you have to do then is connect all the cables and install the memory.

I remember when Kevin Rose built his own mac on the screen savers about 4 years ago or so.  He used an ATX case and fastened the mobo down with cable ties.  He used generic rubber feet underneath to raise it up 1/8 of an inch or so.
Posted by: echebon

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/29/07 03:11 PM

Why not just put it into an ATX case? I built my Sawtooth in an atx case, It is a lot quieter and runs way cooler. It is very easy to do and then you'll have a cool mod to show off.
Posted by: zenstate

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/29/07 04:05 PM

Originally Posted By: "echebon "

Why not just put it into an ATX case? I built my Sawtooth in an atx case, It is a lot quieter and runs way cooler. It is very easy to do and then you'll have a cool mod to show off.


Myself and many other mac users prefer the mac tower form factor.  ATX cases are far too boxy looking for me and the ones that try to look cool often just look tacky.
Posted by: mrbit

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 08/30/07 11:33 AM

yea i love my G4 tower form factor.  Thanks for the replies.  I am will keep you posted as to the progress.
Posted by: Waragainstsleep

Re: Push a G4 gigabit farther question. - 09/01/07 12:54 PM

And no Intel or M$ stickers. That doesn't help with the tackyness.