Opinions on Behavior, Please

Posted by: yoyo52

Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 05:39 PM

Here's the scenario: we're in the public library board room, interviewing the last of the applicants for the directorship. There are four trustees and three employees of the library, plus the interviewee. Half-way through the interview, one of the board members gets up and just leaves. No excuse, no goodbye, no sorry to interrupt.<br><br>I felt pretty sorry for the interviewee, and pretty ashamed for us. But that's me. What do you all think of that person's behavior? Do you think it's OK?<br><br>Great wits are sure to madness near allied.--John Dryden, "Absalom and Achitophel"
Posted by: Giaguara

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 05:47 PM

no it's not ok!!<br><br>Giaguara<br>
Posted by: OSXaddict

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 05:48 PM

And noone knew this person was gonna leave beforehand? Did this person leave for good or did they come back? Was there something that happened prior or did they just get up and leave?<br><br>If there was nothing, then that's just crass and rude both to the interviewee and the rest of the board. Perhaps an opening on the board is imminent? <br><br>
Posted by: sross

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 05:51 PM

If it was one in a series of interviews of the day, it is not unusual for one of the group to get up. In fact, saying something may, in some cases be more disruptive than discretely getting up.<br>If it was a Board made up of citizens (which is usually what Library Boards are made of) then the person getting up was not all that bad. After all, there were seven people in the room and the interviewee should have a thick skin when dealing with a Library Board or any "Non-Profit" orginization. <br>I understand how you feel, but it really wasn't that big a deal. If he/she wasn't adding anything to the interview, it was merely an attendance matter.<br>Remember, they are donating their time.<br>IMO<br><br>
Posted by: yoyo52

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 05:54 PM

Well, all of us, even the employees who stayed long after their ususal quitting time, were donating time--you're right about that.<br><br>Great wits are sure to madness near allied.--John Dryden, "Absalom and Achitophel"
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 05:57 PM

I'm in HR for a not-for-profit and have to agree with you. That board member represents your library in your community and his/her actions reflect on your organization, staff and volunteers. That individual's actions, I feel do not cast a positive image of your organization. The candidate for your Director's position may read this as a negative point for any decision they may have to make in regards to accepting an offer. I know how I would feel if a member of the selection committee was just to get up and walk out! The message I would receive is that I (your board member) really don't care what happens and my time is more important than that of the other members and candidate, so don't count on me for any help or support. Sorry if got long winded, but without GOOD, SUPPORTIVE and DEDICATED volunteers not-for-profits suffer. The role of the staff is already hard enough without having to take on the responsibilities of lay leaders.<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: MacGizmo

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:01 PM

There simply is no excuse in my opinion, but I can respect the idea that it might be more of an interruption to say something rather than just getting up and leaving.<br><br>[color:red] Kiss My Banana!</font color=red><br>Visit me here!
Posted by: carp

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:04 PM

one of the board members gets up and just leaves. No excuse, no goodbye, no sorry to interrupt.<br><br>That person finaly realize that the interview is just another (interogation) an (enqisition) I never understood why.<br><br>That there is this 7 people agains't 1 person?? This stand in front of a court so to speak - applicant must go through a medievil practice just to get a job.<br><br>A personal office that is well seasoned should be able to do the job with one person conducting the interview.<br><br>So much for educators - stop that practice now.<br><br>
Posted by: sross

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:13 PM

You didn't say that in your original post. (staying late)<br>I guess the many that I have sat through have never raised that issue either when others leave or I have to. However, and it is a big however, I certainly can understand and agree that it was probably an uncomfortable situation.<br><br>
Posted by: OSXaddict

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:13 PM

Well...apparently you have never sat through a police interview (for job, not interogation! LOL)<br><br>I have and it's no fun..definately like an inquisition...but one of the hoops that must be jumped through.<br><br>
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:14 PM

Yes, I sorta agree, my concern is that if a volunteer is asked to participate in the hiring process for that type of position, in this care, the Director, and agrees to be part of that process and responsibility, they should approach it in a professional manner. Yes, individuals do have other obligations and may find it necessary to be excussed from the process, but just to get up and walk out to the surprise of everyone else could be viewed negitively by a canidate interviewing for that level of leadership. Lets face it most Directors of not-for-profits understand the relationships and the very important roles volunteers play within that organization and if an individual just walks, as in this case, I feel that action may project the wrong image by implying the perception that the lay leadership really don't care.<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: carp

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:24 PM

LOL<br>right<br><br>My point is that if the personal department is up to par. There is no reason why an applicaint needs to sit in front of a board, with all the quizators takeing there time to be present when all they need to do is list their inquisition on paper for the applicanit to fill out.<br><br>I don't think there needs to be 7 people to judge eye movement by an applicant. One person is plenty.<br><br>I have been in interviews that had 4 prople on the board of inquisition.<br>They asked me the very same questions that I answered on the application. Its nothing but intimidation.<br><br>
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:32 PM

***There is no reason why an applicaint needs to sit in front of a board***<br><br>In most not-for-profits, the CEO/Director report directly to the Board of Directors and not staff, so the Board has the responsibility of hiring, supervision to an extend, evaluations and firing for that position. All other staff are hired by the CEO/Director or designee....in most cases.<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: sross

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:41 PM

Citizen volunteers perform a most valuable function: They serve without compensation and do it for all the good altruistic reasons. Board Members, on the other hand usually are "prominent citizens" who have either raised money or donated money. Unfortunately, some of them are more interested in the title than the effort and, other than regular Board meetings, have little to add to an interview for a Director. After all, the full time job of Director is to also keep the Board happy. Believe me, they know it.<br>In a perfect world, the citizen volunteers should be the Board Members and their committment would shine through.<br>I recently resigned my position as Co-Chairman of the group that oversees a very large agency. My reason: Members either didn't show up for meetings or leave early. If you think getting up and leaving is disruptive, how about talking on the phone and chatting.<br><br>
Posted by: carp

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:44 PM

Explain to me why when you are fired (shiit canned) its always done by one person and not the inquisition board that hired you in the first place??<br><br>My point is that when you apply for a job you already jumped through hoops to even get an interview. Once you get that interview they throw 7 people at you asking the same questions that you answered on your quest to get that interview.<br><br>In this case of 7 people it is a waste of - 6 educators time.<br>The smart one walked out - most likely went back to educate.<br><br><br>
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 06:56 PM

I commend you on your role and professional integrity as a lay leader. I concure with you that many volunteers "Volunteer" just to have their ticket punched or bring their own agends to the table. So many times organizations do a poor job of selecting volunteers and/or providing the proper training as to the responsibilities and expectationsof a volunteer. Then we as not-for-profits, can be guilty of wasting the time of volunteers or not utilizing their strengths they bring to the table.<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:05 PM

What level or position are you refering to? It is my experience, that only middle management and higher go through the selection committee process, in our case volunteers and staff. All other positions are hired by the department supervisor. You are in the Reserves, corrrect? Well, I was just promoted without going before any type of board, just my 201 file was present! When I was on active duty, you went before a Promotion Board.<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: sross

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:09 PM

You probably would have much greater insight into who should be a Board member than, lets say another Board member. Knowing what expertise the prospective member brings to the table and what the needs of the orginazation are, more often than not, don't go hand in hand.<br>I imagine there are many volunteers who would add much to boards but never make it because their talents or dedication goes unnoticed. But, ahh, if there are big bucks involved...........<br><br>
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:11 PM

An explanation of some sort would have been in order. Perhaps he had to be somewhere or meet someone? Nevertheless, it seems quite rude and lacking to just get up and leave. Just a few words to the group stating he had to leave for one reason or another would have been called for, don't you think?<br><br>
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:13 PM

Amen!<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: carp

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:32 PM

Right on Sherman.<br><br>many many volunteers who would add much to boards but never make it because their talents or dedication goes unnoticed. But, ahh, if there are big bucks involved..<br><br>If I was going to volunteer my time, my skills and money to a non profit which I do now. And they gave me a 7 panel of A-holes I would have walked away big time.<br><br>You certainly don't give a volunteer - Bull Shiit for givening up their time for them.<br><br>
Posted by: yoyo52

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:36 PM

I can't say I agree that it's a waste of time. I've been on search committees of all sorts, from this one for director of a library (and it's true that the director reports to us, the trustees, not to anyone else--and in any case it would be kind of odd to have the people who're going to be subordinates hire their boss) to members of my department to the president of my institution--and in every case the importance of having more than one perspective has been demonstrated clearly and regularly.<br><br>I also disagree that it's not fair to have one against seven--although I felt it was unfair when I went before my orals committee in graduate school . I know it's not quite the same thing, but would you be happy to have an HR person hire the next Supreme Court justice? Whoever we hire won't have that kind of authority, but she or he will be overseeing a budget of several million bucks per year, and will have hiring and firing authority over a lot of people. If the person can't stand the attention of seven people, then I think maybe we wouldn't want him or her to work for us.<br><br>Anyway, in job interviews that I've had, the interview process has not seemed to me an inquisition. I mean, the people interviewing me are colleagues (in the discipline that we share if not quite yet in the place where we work), and I've been as much interviewing them as the other way around. If I went to a job interview and there was only one lonely HR person (sorry, Mcteak!) doing the work, I'd begin to wonder about whether I wanted to work at a place where my future colleagues weren't interested enough to see me and be seen by me. The library director is not exactly a colleague of the board members, to be sure--but then we, especially the board president, are as close as he or she is going to get to having colleagues at the workplace. <br><br>The most unfortunate thing about the board member who left the interview is that she could have contributed a perspective that no one else on the committee could. She has for other folks we've talked to. I didn't want to be on the search committee because I knew that it would take up a lot of time, and do so at a time when I really can't afford to give a lot of time--next week is the last week of the semester (I have to remind myself of that often!) and I've had tons of first drafts of term papers to read and return (first drafts are the most labor-intensive reading that I do). Still, having agreed to do it, I've come to all the interviews and been attentive at them all. One of the other trustees was sick as a dog today, but he came and stayed through the whole thing too.<br><br>I know, I know--my resentment's beginning to show <br><br>Great wits are sure to madness near allied.--John Dryden, "Absalom and Achitophel"
Posted by: Mcteak

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 07:54 PM

***If I went to a job interview and there was only one lonely HR person (sorry, Mcteak!) doing the work, I'd begin to wonder about whether I wanted to work at a place where my future colleagues weren't interested enough to see me and be seen by me***<br><br>Bingo! When we hire for our camps each spring, we conduct group interviews. It enables us to see who is comfortable in that type of environment, we get to see the applicants in action, not just responding to questions and it provides the applicants the opportunity to see how we as an organization/program operate. I feel it is very important for any organization to demonstrate 'how they value' a person.<br><br><br>"The day people stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them." Colin Powell
Posted by: carp

Re: Opinions on Behavior, Please - 11/26/02 08:19 PM

Thats my point<br>HR should be able to handle the task without haveing all of you spend time sitting on a board to "Question" someone else. In general -all those questions should have been answered way before the (interview) hate to say it but what a waste of everyones time.<br><br>I know it's not quite the same thing, but would you be happy to have an HR person hire the next Supreme Court justice<br>I would let sross field that one.<br>IMO in that position its more about their political beliefs - their achivements have gotten them there to be even considered as a Supreme Court hopeful. Depending on whos the big whip at the time "prez".<br><br>IMO<br>It is very unfortunate that you even need to have that board hearing. Bad administrative structure is what that shows me. Send people out to ask the same questions that should be on the applications. Normally the HR would send those applications to their respected Bosses to view their applications in the first place..They should then send back their questions for the applicant.<br><br>So what is it??<br>If I crossed my legs to the right or to the left during the quize by the panel do I get the job??? What other reason is there??<br><br><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by carp on 11/26/02 11:20 PM (server time).</EM></FONT></P>