the White House has offered an explanation regarding the "burial at sea"
Yeah well it wasn't a very good one - family members have a right to choose their own undertaker and attend the funeral.
Tell that to all the families over with dead ones buried in flaming rubble.. and the ones who jumped 40+ stories to their death.. holding hands... screaming all the way down... I piss on his rights and his families rights.... I wish they had buried him over here.. so we could take turns pissing on his grave and defiling his burial place.
Well one can't kill someone on grounds of speculation... the more I hear about this case the more obvious it seems that it has to go to trial so that desperate arguments of that kind can be tested by cross examination.
Well I don't think I'd tell them something of your creation, no. I'd tell 'em what I think myself that we in the West should uphold our own standards of law and morality so as to negate the causes of terrorism.
Well, the White House has offered an explanation regarding the "burial at sea" […]
Apart from the killing itself, this "disappearance" of the body is —in my opinion, based on what has reached public media so far, up till now—, the most prosecutable [actionable?] offense in a hypothetical killing of bin Laden trial.
It's not only that the "rights" —mentioned elsewhere in this thread— of a person's family (even when the person is a criminal) have been violated, but that the most rightly offensive violation is the destruction of evidence of a possible malfeasance. The SEALs, as a professional force with a duty entrusted to them by the US Government would, i believe, be acting illegally when disposing of the body —for effectively delivering it out of the reach of any future legitimate investigation that could, for example, require an autopsy—. I believe this to be so unless the SEALs acted on a Superior's order or if the body was, at the time of its dumping into the sea, out of the SEALs team's responsibility.
Who carries the weight of resposibility for sinking that body into the Persian Gulf?
We have seen in another thread the photos of the Secretary of State watching from the "situation room" [in the Do-State(?); in the WH(?)] "the takedown of Bin Laden" —and laughed or raged when the women were photoshopped out of the picture—. The White House was also allegedly in contact with the Commanders of the operation in real time, while it was going on. The people ultimately responsible were, consequently, in the WH.
We, too, have seen real and fictional court trials on TV. Some of us may have been present in real trials in a court of law. From these experiences we may have acquired a fairly accurate sense of how professional procedures on homicide cases work. One thing that i, at least, have learned is that destroying or disposing of a cadaver by criminal[s] or by anybody else is a grave offense that makes the offender[s] liable to harsh punishment.
Originally Posted By: six_of_one
Originally Posted By: katlpablo
The situation is one of general unaccountability.
Mrrr? I think the White House pretty much owned the entire operation. In what way are they not accountable for what happened?
Can we assume that Bin Laden is dead? Probably, and officially, he is. In this situation, in general and at the moment, i see three cases in which, in my opinion, unaccountability, arrives hand in hand with the killing of Bin Laden.
For the first case I'll accept your point above by clarifying that in part what i really wanted to say was that i see an attempt at unaccountability, at evading accountability, as in destroying evidence, exemplified in the case of the disposal of Bin Laden's body.
The second case of unaccountability is about the relationship between Bin Laden and powerful forces in the United States of America, that trained and in a way created him. What actions did they take together that later made them such big enemies? Who were their friends and accomplices in the freedom fighter/terrorist miasmas or in the arms/drugs dealings? What are their dealings as enemies? How did 9/11/2001 come to pass? For me, these are the reasons behind the killing rather than the capturing of Osama Bin Laden alive; Unaccountability.
The third case is the unaccountability of Bin Laden himself vis a vis the victims of NY-9/11 or of other bombings throughout the world in that, with this killing, he evades facing the living victims of his acts. Why will the people that lost sons, daughters, parents, family, friends, loved ones never have now the opportunity to write to him in his cell and tell him "I piss on you.", or insult him when he appears at the trial, or someone who, at court, hits him in the face with a shoe in the Arabic way, so he can understand their anger.
Loc: Sunnyvale, CA, USA
Well, there is a Navy Seal posthumous Medal of Honor? Silver Star? recipient who rejected an illegal action that eventually resulted in his death in the course of a massive firefight against hugely overwhelming force. Unfortunately forget the name. IIRC, he had a jurisprudence, or left law school or something like that.
It goes something like: Extremely forward patrol/recon, covert op, or something. Then came upon by a few civilians. Team wanted to kill them. As team leader he mounted a discourse, knowing full well the civilians may be sympathizers who would betray them to Afghans, made his points which the team accepted, concensus, then let the civilians go.
They were betrayed and came under massive fire. IIRC, his extreme valor was a stick and move to a spot with zero cover, exposed to fire, in order to get his commo off unobstructed by 'canyon shadow', to save his team. IIRC, after taking body hits, the recipient/operator noted that he politely ended with 'thank you', as was his mannerly nature.
So, some of these guys do do the right thing, regardless of the price of honor and integrity. Apparently, honor, integrity, doing the right thing are meaningless for many Americans. Well, America, by consequence from several recent events, wretched bill come due, is in a jungle rule epoch, anyway. That's why you need a lot of money to insulate yourself and yours from the consequences of the wretched mass.
Loc: Sunnyvale, CA, USA
Jerry, I may be down your way this winter. A Filipino friend of mine is foregoing his annual summer sexual rape and pillage ( well, enthusiastically catered, so rape and pillage is not entirely accurate ), so I've offered to treat him this winter, as I'm interested in property and a house there.
Of course I have zero interest in his interests, cheap nubile young girls, bar girls, etc, but I understand (from my friend) that I can get a house built on property a few blocks from the beautiful beaches for about $50K. Sounds like it would be nice to have that.
Stuff sounds cheap to get done. My friend apparently had a party hooch, an open thatched-roof version, platform, built-in lounge seating, etc built on his front lawn for a few hundred dollars ( which normally I would do in the back, but my friend's objective was a 'party central' invitation/advertisement/whatever, and from accounts of his past exploits, it sounds like he accomplished that ).
I have to ask: Now, this kind of living, is that why you are there, Jerry?
Anyway, I'll probably be there winter. Maybe hook up ( not in the sexual connotation, of course )
Hey, what's the surf like? My friend doesn't know surfing from his arse, so he wouldn't know. Do you get 'winter' swells, whenever your winter is?
I Live in Cebu which is the sister city of the South from manila.By plane is 1 hour to travel. Cebu is a great city full of foreigners and the prices of real estate here is not that much.Lots of shopping malls to go to also. Where is this property in the Philippines?You can buy a nice house here for about $30,000 USD.Three bedroom 2 bath with a large backyard also.Please let me know where it is and I will be glad to further help you.Jerry
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