• AppleCentral Network:
  • Tech Support
  • |
  • Open Source
  • |
  • Apple News
  • |
  • Register Domains
  • |
  • SSL Certificates
  • |
  • iPod Deals
  • |
  • Mac Deals
  • |
  • Mac Book Shelf
  • AppleCentral Home
  • MacTech Magazine
    • About MacTech in Print
    • Issue Table of Contents
    • Subscribe
    • Risk Free Sample
    • Back Issues
    • MacTech DVD
    • MacTech Archives
    • MacTech Print Archives
    • MacMod
    • MacTutor
    • FrameWorks
    • develop
  • MacNews.com
    • MacNews News
    • Blog
    • MacTech Reviews and KoolTools
    • Whitepapers, Screencasts, Videos and Books
    • News Scanner
    • Rumors Scanner
    • Documentation Scanner
  • Apple Expo
    • by Category
    • by Company
    • by Product
  • MacForge.net
  • Job Board
  • Advertising
    • Benefits of MacTech
    • Mechanicals and Submission
    • Dates and Deadlines
    • Submit Apple Expo Entry
  • User
    • Register for Ongoing Raffles
    • Register new user
    • Edit User Settings
    • Logout
  • Contact
    • Customer Service
    • Webmaster Feedback
    • Submit News or PR
    • Suggest an article
  • Connect Tools
    • MacTech Live Podcast
    • RSS Feeds
    • Twitter
You are not logged in. [Log In] AppleCentral » Forums » General Discussion » Soapbox » gays vs. homosexuals
Register User    Forum List        Active Topics    FAQ
Page 14 of 14 < 1 2 ... 12 13 14
Go to page...
Topic Options
Hop to:
#516725 - 05/02/10 07:08 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: Reboot]
Antonio Offline

NArF!

Registered: 06/01/05
Posts: 401
Loc: San Francisco, CA
I'll mention what I mentioned to someone earlier- it's not permanent. It's a week to cool off and assess things.
_________________________
“Creative ability is best displayed with the most basic tools."

Website Facebook Twitter House of Hackers

Top
#516727 - 05/02/10 07:20 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: Antonio]
Reboot Offline

Muhahahaha

Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 15046
Loc: Columbus OH
Cooler heads prevailed, vacation is over.
_________________________
AppleCentral Trivia

MM-MCF Trivia

Call the Doctor

Top
#516729 - 05/02/10 07:31 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: lanovami]
keymaker Offline


Registered: 12/14/07
Posts: 6026
What you're talking about there is delivering a correct word with a derogatory tone which makes the tone derogatory but not the word. One could deliver 'gay' with the same sneering attitude but that doesn't make the word derogatory. By contrast If you call someone a 'faggot' because he's homosexual that's derogatory irrespective of the tone so the word itself is derogatory.

km

Top
#516732 - 05/02/10 07:59 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: keymaker]
lanovami Offline
This space for rent

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 7405
Loc: 東京都
Thank you km, for finding your way in to reply amongst all this muckery. I mean it.

One could deliver the word "homosexual" or "bastard" to a gay person or someone born illegimately quite unsneeringly and I would bet you that most people would not be comfortable with it. In the specific case of both people I mentioned, they are pretty thick-skinned but I would never call them a "homosexual" or a "bastard" regardless of how unsneeringly I said it, because I sincerely doubt it would be taken well at all. One has to consider the listener's feelings as well, and whether a term is derogatory or not is in the ear of the behearer, in my opinion. I refer back to my story of the couple I met in a park a few years back. We all make mistakes, but I would not willfully continue using a word that is considered derogatory by others, because it would show a lack of respect, and it also gives someone an excuse not to listen to me at all. And I do like to talk. (:

btw, in my time and region, the word "faggot" as opposed to "fag" had such a strong connotation that I didn't hear it used very often at all, especially not directly to anyone. "Homo" and "homosexual" were words however that people had no compunction about using.
_________________________
We are what we repeatedly do - Aristotle

Top
#516733 - 05/02/10 08:24 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: keymaker]
lanovami Offline
This space for rent

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 7405
Loc: 東京都
btw, I made one more comment which you may or may not have seen; I could certainly see how you might have missed it among all that mess. I will paste it again below. I was curious if you had any more thoughts on this as well.
-------
And just to make it clear; I don't believe that the difference in people's opinions about "gays" in the military as opposed to "homosexuals" in the military is:

"because gays are perceived as persons who happen to be happy and carefree whereas homosexuals are those who indulge in same-sex activities."

I believe it is much more likely because the word "gays" to describe a sexual orientation has lost most of the negative connotation it may have had for most people, while the word "homosexuals" stirs up negative feelings in people because it still has negative connotations for most people.

But that does not mean you are not entitled to your theory, km.
_________________________
We are what we repeatedly do - Aristotle

Top
#516734 - 05/02/10 08:52 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: lanovami]
keymaker Offline


Registered: 12/14/07
Posts: 6026
I take the view that the prejudiced listener will hear 'gay' and 'homosexual' with equal contempt whereas the objective listener will hear them both with equanimity. If that's right then the word itself is not influential where its meaning is generally agreed.

km

Top
#516740 - 05/02/10 01:04 PM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: keymaker]
lanovami Offline
This space for rent

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 7405
Loc: 東京都
O...K... a person sufficiently prejudiced (against gays I assume?) would indeed hear both the word "gays" and the word "homosexuals" with equal contempt. And an "objective listener", if there is such a thing, would hear both terms with equanimity. So both of these groups, whatever the hell they mean, would hear both terms with equanimity, just a different type of equanimity... I don't see why anyone could have any other view of the two "listeners" that you posit.

I still, and I give you my solemn promise that I really am trying, have absolutely no idea how this in anyway addresses (let alone explains) the question of why a poll conducted with two different groups of people (Democrats if it matters) got such skewed results when only the word "gays (and lesbians)" was transposed with "homosexuals" when asked what people thought about having gays/homosexuals serve openly in the military.

On the off chance that you were making a general statement relating to our discussions (which I doubt because your latest post immediately followed my post reintroducing the topic of the two polls) I would still have a hard time wondering exactly or even inexactly it is that you are addressing.

Reading comprehension was always the area I scored highest in on aptitude tests, but admittedly it's been a decade or two...
_________________________
We are what we repeatedly do - Aristotle

Top
#516743 - 05/02/10 02:39 PM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: lanovami]
keymaker Offline


Registered: 12/14/07
Posts: 6026
I didn't even read the poll - mainly because Reboot gave the impression that it would be a bit of a chore to wade through it with all the links. My observations stem from this - that if I were asked whether gays should serve in the military or whether homosexuals should I'd give the same answer because to me it's the same question. If people give different answers it seems to me that they're distinguishing between the meanings of the two terms which focuses attention on 'gay' as the prime suspect because it's the least precise. As to prejudiced persons showing equanimity I'd say that would be unduly flattering of them.

km

Top
#516769 - 05/02/10 08:39 PM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: keymaker]
lanovami Offline
This space for rent

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 7405
Loc: 東京都
The possibility that you were one of the objective listeners that you posited did occur to me. Well, I am fairly certain I would have given the same answer whichever term was used as well. It may prove that we are objective listeners, yet it also proves we would understand the unambiguous meaning of the word "gay" in the question we were given, lest we risk giving two answers for the two words, regardless of our objectiveness (or prejudice for that matter).

The objectiveness of the listeners in these polls is exactly what I believe led to the difference between the two polls. It had absolutely nothing to do with some people in the poll which used the word "gays" getting confused whether the question was asking about "homosexuals" or people who are happy/colorful and/or laughable.

_________________________
We are what we repeatedly do - Aristotle

Top
#516790 - 05/03/10 01:21 AM Re: gays vs. homosexuals [Re: lanovami]
Leslie Offline
Proud MacBabe. Happy everything to everybody.

Registered: 05/06/05
Posts: 3603
Loc: B.C. Canada
You can call me a lesbian, you can call me a homosexual just don't call me late for a beer!

Top
Page 14 of 14 < 1 2 ... 12 13 14
Go to page...
Previous Topic
View All Topics Index
Next Topic

Tweet

Preview

Moderator:  Acumowchek, MacGizmo, Moderator, neil, Reboot 
Print Topic
Switch to Threaded Mode
Publications, Articles and Industry Discussion
   »MacTech/MacNews Article Discussions
   »Apple World
Marketplace
   »Deals and Special Offers
      »Expired Offers
   »Trading Warehouse
Mac
   »Hardware
   »Software
   »Servers, Security, and Networking
   »Programming, Web Dev & Scripting
   »Windows and Virtualization
   »Cloud and Online Services
Mobile Technologies
   »iPhone Apps, AppStore, and iTunes
   »iPad, iPhone, iPod and Apple TV Hardware
Mods and Hacks
   »General Mods
      »Techniques
      »Miscellaneous
      »Mod Logs
   »Laptop Mods
      »Case Mods
      »Hardware Mods
      »Misc. Mods
   »Desktop Mods
      »Case Mods
      »Hardware Mods
      »Misc. Mods
   »Peripheral Mods
      »iPod Mods
      »Misc Mods
   »Software Hacks & Mods
General Discussion
   »Site Feedback & Issues
   »Stan's Lounge
   »Soapbox
Now Software Support
   »Announcements
   »Now X
      »FAQs
      »Discussion
   »Now Up-to-Date & Contact
      »Community Help
      »Tips and tricks
View profile
Send a PM
View homepage
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
View profile
Send a PM
Add to your Watched Users
View posts
Board Rules · Mark all read
Contact Us · AppleCentral · Top

MacTech Only Search:
Community Search:

 
 
 

 
 
 
 
 
  • SPREAD THE WORD:
  • Slashdot
  • Digg
  • Del.icio.us
  • Reddit
  • Newsvine
  • Generate a short URL for this page:



AppleCentral. www.applecentral.com
Main office: 805-494-9797
Xplain's use of MacNews, AppleCentral and AppleExpo are not affiliated with Apple, Inc. MacTech is a registered trademark of Xplain Corporation. AppleCentral, MacNews, Xplain, "The journal of Apple technology", Apple Expo, Explain It, MacDev, MacDev-1, THINK Reference, NetProfessional, MacTech Central, MacTech Domains, MacForge, and the MacTutorMan are trademarks or service marks of Xplain Corp. Sprocket is a registered trademark of eSprocket Corp. Other trademarks and copyrights appearing in this printing or software remain the property of their respective holders.
All contents are Copyright 1984-2010 by Xplain Corporation. All rights reserved. Theme designed by Icreon.
Generated in 0.035 seconds in which 0.024 seconds were spent on a total of 14 queries. Zlib compression enabled.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.5.8