Loc: Alexandria, VA
I don't mind the debates at all that Keymaker starts here.
Actually, I don't either. I just came to the realization that they're crafted mostly as flame-bait and actually trying to participate meaningfully in them is largely a waste of time ...
Which is too bad, because some of the core issues are worthy of discussion ...
It is just that people need to read his posts and possibly think for a minute or two before taking the hook, the line, and the sinker before they go on the attack.
The problem there is that if people took time to think, they'd actually see the hook, line and sinker that's being dangled before them and wouldn't even bother to respond. I still don't see why you're trying to ruin KM's fun by telling people to think ;-)
The is no fun at all if all of his posts turn into tit for tat threads with no content.
If it's merely a trap waiting to be sprung, why are you expecting content? That's like expecting an entire wheel when in reality there's just a crumb of cheese as bait ...
[…] I asked you a very direct question […] and you have yet to answer. […] Give me a straight answer. DOH!
On this, steveg, i agree completely with you , km is a bit of a manipulative provocateur. Like in this very post.
That may not bother me until a certain point is reached, the point where the exchange ends and the result is like an unfinished conversation… where further —and sometimes even the original— questions are ignored and left purposely unanswered.
Although i tend to agree with km on most of these discussions —and have posted a few times my views in backing of our common ones—, on occasion when i have asked direct questions looking for clarification on his purpose or opinion regarding a given one of his posts, i have rarely received an acknowledgement of my question and, i think, never an answer.
In that respect it's less encouraging to participate because i feel that i'm playing into this other person's post because there is a common point of view, but i'm not getting much support from him in exchange. [/rant]
Thank you. I've been trying to figure out how to express exactly what you just said.
Yes, I am guilty of taking the bait. Because, just once, I would like to see km make a point in a straightforward, transparent manner. Just once I would like to see him actually take a challenge head-on instead of twisting the dialog like a t-shirt being tie-died. And just once, I would like to not be reminded that "we lot" are somehow incapable of being proper citizens of the word.
Paul, stop whining about how others choose to debate a point. Arguing with a wall built of alternating layers of arrogance and egocentricity is no fun either. Yeah, the answer is don't get sucked in, which, to six's point, results in dead air.
And to the other half of the km fan club — the one with the persecution complex and the big rock in her hand — your tin foil hat is too tight. Nobody is telling you what you can or can't say here. Nobody is sanctioning anything. And nobody controls anything here. It's all in your head. As carp might say, <--- Do you get it now?
Few people are capable of drawing a believable caricature of themselves. But I congratulate you — and even thank you — for succeeding in doing just that. Mazeltov! You should sign it, frame it, and hang it on your wall.
Yup. I've agreed with or supported a number of his points in other posts. The problem is that even agreeing must be unconditional and on his terms only. Tends to flatten otherwise multi-dimensional debates. Very frustrating.
Paul, stop whining about how others choose to debate a point.
You ask KM to change his way of arguing a point but I can't ask you to stop being a sucker and personally attacking KM every chance you get most of the time without even thinking like this thread? (Not going to point out the irony of you also demanding I stop whining Officer.)
KM is pretty clear about what he wants to talk about. Like this thread it really is pretty obvious. No flame bait, but a modest amount of reading comprehension necessary. Does he have an obligation to answer you? No. As much as an obligation to pat kattalbo on the head if they are in agreement.
And your reference to Celandine's point is about as endearing as a dead rat which you normally bring to any discussion with her. But she speaks the truth. You have over the years belittled (for example your post to Celandine just now) people who do not agree with you. Bashing people with flags come to mind and no, as you have asked me, I won't forge or get over it. It's just an example of your, as you call it, "give as good as you get" bullying.
Of all the contentious things that have occurred in this forum over the years the most common denominator is you. Has it ever occurred to you that you post like a complete ĺsshole sometimes? I do it too on occasion but I usually figure it out if I cannot convince others of their reading comprehension problem. Then I admit I am a jackass at times. You've been a total jackass to Celandine and KM for example but have you ever admitted it?
But it's one hour before flood tide and the fishies call.
but I usually figure it out if I cannot convince others of their reading comprehension problem
Speaks volumes about your self-assumed intellectual superiority, and brings me right back to you're either with me or you're stupid approach to debate. No pattern of belittlement there, right? Nah... 'course not.
Regarding your fellow fan club member, keep in mind that since I ended my hiatus from this forum more than a year ago, I have not once engaged or referred to her unless first confronted. And when referred to as a pissant or by the size of my nose or lack of height — or most most entertaining, my "ringleadership" — you better believe I will engage.
We all have the capacity to be assholes of one stripe or another. Good to see you can admit your own inclusion in that club. And as far as admitting my own membership, I have always owned up to what I say. But whether it's viewed as jackassian or not is entirely dependent on each reader's POV, and if you read through this and any other "contentious" threads, you'll see that those points of view do not all lean in one direction. It's called intellectual diversity. Deal with it. I do.
Now go catch fish — speaking of hooks, lines, and sinkers.
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