... and just own up to the fact the only way we'll ever get decent health care in this country is to scrap the system we have and start new?

The cost questions puzzle me greatly as well. No one bothered asking how we'd pay for two wars that were both destined, and projected by many to last 15 years or more.

Health care is a right, not a privilege. The fact that anyone on the planet doesn't receive the best care when needed is epic fail in this experiment we call civilization. Health care shouldn't cost anyone anything. Yes, I know that's a fantasy because we're not intelligent enough a species to live without money.

The fact that most of the more religious people I personally know are the ones whining about paying for others only singles them out as horrible hypocrites. They should be first in line to offer to pay for those less fortunate.

My prediction is that reform with fail yet again, thanks to the huge amount of money the insurers are throwing at this. As predicted, costs will double in the next ten years like it has doubled in the last ten, and THEN we'll finally get a single-payer system because there will be no other alternative. By then only 20% of the people will have insurance and they'll be paying for the emergency care of the other 80%.

Like the housing price/mortgage escalation, the current system with it's huge annual price increases is unsustainable. It will crash too, it's just a matter of when and if we'll get ahead of it this time. I have little hope that this will happen. Too much BS being spewed and too many gullible people who believe it without question.

You need to clarify - most of the more right wingnut religious people. They argue against health insurance reform, specifically the public option, because they don't want to pay for the uninsured. They, and we, are already paying for the uninsured in higher medical and insurance costs. Yes, we have the best health care in the world, but only for those who can afford to pay for it and those selfish folks don't want to give up that "privilege."

Universal health insurance/care is a no-brainer. Why is it that the no-brainers are so set against it?

You're right on all counts. The reform being considered now only tries to bring the uninsured into the tent. We will still have the same inefficient system in place with a very large part of our health care dollar going to bean counters, paperwork and administration.

But it's a start. We have to get everyone insured before we can even think about moving to a real national healthcare system. We can then possibly join other first world countries in the way they treat their citizens.

It would be much better to replace the whole thing but the reality of big money lobbying would never let that happen. Obama would be painted as a socialist. Oh wait, he already is.

I used to find this puzzling but no longer. If one is so weak in one's morals that it is necessary to fear an omnipotent dude in the sky in order to be good then you are one immoral very stupid and ignorant person. So this person being fooled by the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Hannity and Beck is not surprising at all. Idiots out for only a little money being followed by stupid sheep.

If one is so weak in one's morals that it is necessary to fear an omnipotent dude in the sky in order to be good then you are one immoral very stupid and ignorant person.


You toss one hell of a blanket. Talk about blind, ignorant and intolerant. I understand atheist/agnostic . . . but I will never understand your dedicated flame throwing hostility.

Probably just as well.

Course we all have Canadian friends here at the Forums and many who don't come here very often (like Marge). I haven't heard any terrible stories from them about the Canadian system, so I tend to think all the BS about how horrible the Canadian system is (one we are looking at taking some ques from) on TV and radio is just that BS.

Well got a request from a Canadian lady for some culture samples and I asked her. Never hurts to get more information. Here's the discourse.



"Personally there is a wait for specialist but if it is a serious illness you are seen immediately free of cost - at no cost. which is great from a humanitarian point of view. Google a search for Canadian health care under e OHIP as this is a business e mail I cannot say more. It cost me about 2 thousand a year for excellent health care. as cancer survivor it cost me nothing


when is the T Reiter coming.

Patrice Simmons
Senior Technologist, Immunodiagnostics Laboratory
Syphilis Confirmatory
Public Health Lab Toronto"

So WTF is all the beef about with these Town Hall thugs raising H3LL ?

My other point is they say they don't want "Obamacare". FINE ! NO one say you HAVE to take it... they've said that over and over... but what's wrong with giving OTHERS a CHOICE to get something new ?? HOW does that hurt anyone ??

I am hostile to all religions and all people who use them as a crutch and an excuse to screw up the world we all live in. Sue me. I used to tolerate them but they really are just dumb. That the majority of people who are against Obama's plan to care for the uninsured are religious is not all that surprising. A group that believes in fantasy also believes that the poor get what they deserve. What a surprise.

I can ignore them or I can fall back on my belief of the Invisible Pink Unicorn. Sure makes a lot more sense than any of the stupid stuff the three desert dogmas pump out.

Can people believe whatever they want? Sure, as long as they get taxed like everyone else and they don't try to brainwash my children or force my government to do stupid things. Once they do all that I will quit being such a jackass and you can believe any fantasy you want.

Except, you keep lumping all of us in with the vocal extremists who get all of the headlines.