<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>Falklands, the British considered their land and citizens was invaded upon. <br><p><hr></blockquote><p> I completely agree with you that waging war is only justifiable on grounds of national security. I would draw a distinction however between waging war and defending a friendly power which is not remotely what we're doing in Iraq or Afghanistan where we're hated and despised except by our own unrepresentative puppets.<br><br>km<br><br>
Iraq is an invention of European colonialist interests. Vietnam was the last bastion of French colonialism in Asia--indeed, the day that the last French forces left, indeed as they were leaving, the first American "advisors" arrived. Colonialism in the post-WW II era is more neo than not.<br><br>[color:red]</font color=red> [color:orange]</font color=orange> [color:yellow]</font color=yellow> [color:green]</font color=green> [color:blue]</font color=blue> [color:purple]</font color=purple>
_________________________ MACTECHubi dolor ibi digitus
Yes I meant "we"- USA... lanovami was right.<br><br>we didn't need the Boxer rebellion, Spanish -American War, WWI, Korea, VIetnam, or even Desert Storm. WWII was different the whole world was on the brink, Germany, Italy, and Japan were wrecking the whole planet. We had no choice - esp after being attacked. Some say we knew of Pearl, but regardless whether we did or not- we had to throw in with the Allies and get the world back to normalcy.<br><br>but WWI would most likely have ended a stalemate and Germany never defeated. This might have prevented the rise of Hitler who played on the German defeat and rose to power. It's all speculation, but he had good arguments for it.<br><br>David (OFI)
and, as opposed to President George W. Bush and many others of his "cadre".<br><br>(i also wanted to point out to anyone reading that the word courage was used here, not "hero".)<br><br><br><br>"fly peacock, fly."<br><br>[color:red]Libertarian Communist</font color=red>
i don't think mccaine has snowballs chance in hell. i made my post delineating that he WILL be in debates and thus it is a excellent opportunity to set some things straight and concurrently, at least in word, show the world that are we are not all blind, deaf, and dumb to our own history and place in the world.<br><br><br><br>"fly peacock, fly."<br><br>[color:red]Libertarian Communist</font color=red>
heh. you said "intervention".<br><br>in just war theory and UN charter is that synonymous with "legitimate use of force"?<br><br>no. :)<br><br><br><br>"fly peacock, fly."<br><br>[color:red]Libertarian Communist</font color=red>
<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>nt on and on about his war record and heroism, or if people around him did, or if the media did, I would have more of a problem with it. But as far as I can see, they don't. And as has been said, there are multitudes like him who participated in these actions. Should they be fired from the jobs they have or be denied social security or put in prison or otherwise somehow publicly villified? I don't have enough wisdom to make a call on that one.<p><hr></blockquote><p>i never left mccaine.<br><br>should america admit and amend its wrongs? sure. but there is something happening RIGHT NOW that gives us an opportunity to at least talk about it:<br><br>mccaine will debate as presidential contender, the only one from his party, on Iraq. he should be challenged on his views of Iraq; he should be challenged that it is the SAME attitude, the same mindset that defends our involvement in Vietnam; the idea that we SHOULD have been allowed to win needs to be plowed under once and for all --for we never should have been there militarily. mcciane thinks we were justified in both Vietnam and Iraq. he'll try to dice it up a bit, but he should be called to make these views loud and clear and then the other side should clearly and loudly denounce those views. no one with such views should be president.<br><br>will any of that happen? i highly doubt it. it would however be take courage and self-sacrifice to anyone who dared. that is the kind of courage we need today, despite that it has been shown you will be "swiftboated"m called a nonpatriot, etc., for doing so. only the extremely eloquent could make such a case and maintain their run for the presidency. <br><br>who has what it takes anymore? i fear no one left, at this point in time. it may be generations. by then america may not be so relevant.<br><br>so, do you want to gamble or do you want to do the right thing? there should be no question what the answer to that is. gambling vs. doing the right thing? how did we get to such a place where such absurdness can arise.<br><br>mccaine could he anyone with the same views, but in his case, POW, etc. it is particularly poignant. i wish ppl to think about these things when they see him on dais. that dais should be as far, and it is plenty far enough, those ideas go. they shall pass no farther. they should be renounced and turned back. mccaine brings it and so should be made to say it clearly, he represents many. it is past time for that very debate to be courageously killed and buried. it shall not have new places of honor on the american horizon, it has enough; it has never admitted, never amended, never sought anything but more false glorification.<br><br><br><br>"fly peacock, fly."<br><br>[color:red]Libertarian Communist</font color=red>
i'm talking the american presidential election. my thread starter makes that clear. not the USSR, not all or any unjust war... only what is relevant to this election and its specific participants.<br><br><br><br>"fly peacock, fly."<br><br>[color:red]Libertarian Communist</font color=red>
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