<br>yes<br><br><br><br>[color:green]"...or am I a butterfly that's dreaming she's a woman?"</font color=green> [color:green]. . . _ _ _ . . .</font color=green><br>

LOL !! Good one, Llewelyn !<br><br>I'll tell ya a true story... went to a meeting in New Orleans one March (mid-1980s) and didn't take a heavy coat. A bad Cold front blew in and we all about froze our azzes off... very windy too.<br><br>I couldn't believe it would be that cold in N.O. <br><br>And that proves there really is no Global Warming !! <br><br>David (OFI)

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p> it makes no sense to just go on pumping carbon dioxide into the atmosphere at growing and growing levels. I personally want to leave this world in some pretty good shape when my ticket is up. To do otherwise is remarkably selfish.<p><hr></blockquote><p>Then stop breathing. And never, ever, ever ride in gas burning, oil consuming vehicle ever again. <br><br>***********************<br>

<br>Are you arguing that it's NOT a rare occurrence?<br>...or were you just being flippant about it?<br><br><br><br>[color:green]"...or am I a butterfly that's dreaming she's a woman?"</font color=green> [color:green]. . . _ _ _ . . .</font color=green><br>

Shift Happens! <br>LOL <br>We froze our coconuts off <br>on Flagler Beach one year.<br><br>Seriously! The coconuts that <br>we were bringing back from <br>the Keys as souvenirs froze <br>solid in the boot of our car &<br>had to the thrown away.<br><br>It was the same year Florida <br>lost almost it's entire stock<br>of orange groves. <br><br>Luckily, these things don't<br>occur with any regularity.<br><br>Funny it should come up... <br>I had just mentioned it to <br>treebeard just yesterday...<br>I told him about losing so<br>many orchards and mused <br>if it was his nursery that<br>may have supplied the <br>replacements...<br><br>Typically. he "smilied" &<br>sed: "It's wot I "do"." <br><br>I replied "It's an ill wind<br>that blows no one any good." <br><br><br><br><br>[color:green]"...or am I a butterfly that's dreaming she's a woman?"</font color=green> [color:green]. . . _ _ _ . . .</font color=green><br>

No one is suggesting that anyone do that.<br><br>However, I did feel pretty bad about flying to Nashville and also flying to Sacramento last year. Those two flights put more CO2 into the atmosphere than driving my car all year long.<br><br>The point however is not necessarily just feeling bad or blaming people individually. We need to work as a whole market to create cleaner alternatives. If we charged the real end cost of fossil fuels including the health effects of heavy particulate matter and the costs we pay to secure it all, everyone would be mad about coal and oil because it hurt our economy. Since those charges are hidden from us in our high medical bills and tremendous defense budget, we act as though doing anything different would be too expensive.<br><br>-- Charlie Alpha Roger Yankee Whiskey

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>However, I did feel pretty bad about flying to Nashville and also flying to Sacramento last year. Those two flights put more CO2 into the atmosphere than driving my car all year long.<p><hr></blockquote><p>In all seriousness .. joking aside .. you felt bad about flying? <br><br>***********************<br>

it's a "Black & White" trap<br>you say "cut back"<br>they say "quit breathing"<br><br>no one wants to stop breathing<br>ergo no one has a reason to cut back<br><br>LOL IOW ...SAVE YER BREATH...<br><br><br><br><br><br>[color:green]"...or am I a butterfly that's dreaming she's a woman?"</font color=green> [color:green]. . . _ _ _ . . .</font color=green><br>

If you look at per person CO2 emissions the average person in the US should feel bad about something:<br><br>U.S. Per Person emissions<br>24.3 tons CO2/person/year<br>Japan Per Person emissions<br>10.7 tons CO2/person/year<br>E.U. Per Person emissions<br>10.6 tons CO2/person/year<br>China Per Person emissions<br>3.9 tons CO2/person/year<br>India Per Person emissions<br>1.9 tons CO2/person/year<br>World average Per Person emissions<br>5.6 tons CO2/person/year<br><br>Flying is one of the most wasteful CO2 emitting things anyone can do at 1.36 pounds of CO2 per mile traveled per passenger. So my flight out to San Diego and back last week was over 4 tons of CO2 produced and my flight out to Salt Lake and back next month will be 2.5 tons. So using up what the average person in the world expends in just those two trips is an eye opener. So in all seriousness we should find ways to cut back on these trips. <br><br>I've tried successfully to cut back on business trips. For vacation I will just continue to feel bad but I'll still do it. I think exposing my family to other world cultures has more of a payoff which counteracts the myopic view of people who do not travel out of one's home country. Unfortunately air travel is the only sensible way to get to Europe.<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>

You know, Matt, I respect your point that it could all be that we just don't know enough about climate and in the long run, there is nothing to worry about. But the world has never had so many people before, and never had so many making such an impact; so to be on the safe side shouldn't we try doing something just in case?<br><br>Having said, the "do something" line, I will say I was not impressed going home this Christmas. Al Gore is all over the news, but almost everyone I visited on my trip home was more wasteful than I remembered. Some examples: My family never ever used to throw away aluminum cans (5 cents deposit, get 7 of em and you have another can of cola!), but they do now. I was floored. They said they don't have the space, but it is a hell of a lot more space than I have in Japan. And the number of SUVs on the road was mind boggling, and I asked my friends to hit their mileage button for me to confirm their ridiculous gas mileage. The number of SUVs with one driver at the wheel in Los Angeles almost made me develop a hacking cough on sight alone.<br><br>I couldn't believe the waste. Japan can be wasteful too, but as one example, I have met very few people who don't recycle aluminum cans, even though there is no deposit here. Of course, just recycling cans is not going to save the world, but it's one example. Maybe regulated "carbon footprints (on an individual and corporate level) should be legislated like car seats and taxes. Ways around such legislation would almost immediately be devised, but it would be a start.<br><br>And, as I am rambling, I must soberly say that as much as we gab about it, I think we all know that things are going to have to get a lot worse before any real, unilateral changes are made to slow our impact on the environment. It's human nature.<br><br>We are what we repeatedly do. -Aristotle